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Old 28-03-2018, 12:38   #11
Malcolm Tucker
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Probably colonise the solar system though and beyond though.
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Old 28-03-2018, 12:40   #12
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Originally Posted by Enoch Powell View Post
I don't recycle, and won't either. Because it won't make a jot of difference. It could, it would, if it went hand in hand with other necessary measures. But all that will happen is we use it to continue growing for longer, and we'll still end up using the same amount of plastic and everything else, that we would have used anyway. In the end it will all be for naught. Like if all the passengers on the Titanic used teaspoons to bail water out of their sinking ship.
From a macro perspective you're probably right, but I'd rather we used less, recycled more and enjoyed a less polluted country.
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Old 28-03-2018, 12:44   #13
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From a macro perspective you're probably right, but I'd rather we used less, recycled more and enjoyed a less polluted country.
To all intents and purposes the country level is macro. I don't litter, or think we should harm our environment, that's different - I do dispose of rubbish properly, I wouldn't pour oil down the drain or throw a plastic bottle in the bushes. But while we can reduce per capita waste by recycling, the government is hellbent on increasing the population, forever, so overall waste will continue to rise, just maybe a bit slower. It's so stupid. How many people see this? I don't think many do.
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Old 28-03-2018, 12:44   #14
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Glass seems an obvious alternative as well but what about weight and breakages?
I think there's a place for both, depends on the product. Bring back the milk man TBH.

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I think cartons biodegrade far better than glass as well, which is the whole point of not using plastic at all. No matter how well we recycle, some is still going to be chucked away in normal bins.
Most current cartons are lined with plastic.

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Ultimately we need to be in a position where virtually no plastic is winding up in the environment any more and clean up operations will actually achieve net reductions each year, rather than just slowing the increase.
Our entire civilisation needs to change; a transition back to permaculture and smaller scale local resources is the future unless we want to live in a totalitarian corporatocracy.
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Old 28-03-2018, 12:46   #15
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In nature a species usually has a predator that keeps their population in balance with their environment's ability to support them, time for Skynet TBH.
Man is the only creature with the intelligence to know both that he SHOULD control his numbers, and with the ability to do it (contraception and abstinence). That we choose not to is because we are stupid, short-sighted and selfish.
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Old 28-03-2018, 12:51   #16
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Worse is that we're reversing natural selection where the least able are encouraged to breed more, where of course our elites are happy with the fresh batch of Gammas, Deltas and Epsilons to keep the cogs turning and the corporate profits growing.
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Old 28-03-2018, 12:55   #17
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The fact we subsidise large families in the name of pursuing endless growth, while existing humans don't have homes, jobs or enough to eat, makes me sad... and mad.
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Old 28-03-2018, 12:56   #18
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'The situation is bad... how can we make it worse? Let's grow more! What could go wrong?'

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“I don't see much future for the Americans... it's a decayed country. And they have their racial problem, and the problem of social inequalities... my feelings against Americanism are feelings of hatred and deep repugnance... everything about the behaviour of American society reveals that it's half Judaised, and the other half negrified. How can one expect a State like that to hold together?”
— a wise man named Adolf Hitler
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Old 28-03-2018, 13:00   #19
Malcolm Tucker
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I think there's a place for both, depends on the product. Bring back the milk man TBH.
Yes, true. It could also be linked to price. Glass is certainly more "premium" compared to cardboard.

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Most current cartons are lined with plastic.
Yeah but IIRC there's new types being looked into that don't have it. Or they have some kind of new 'bioplastic' which apparently is made from sugar and harmlessly degrades. I don't think any are are on the shelf yet, but the current "tetra-pak" won't be around forever.

If nothing else they have the plastic screw top which needs to be changed.


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Our entire civilisation needs to change; a transition back to permaculture and smaller scale local resources is the future unless we want to live in a totalitarian corporatocracy.
Probably, and I think that is actually becoming more likeable anyway. In the 80s and 90s it was all about disposable living but we're clearly getting a bit fed up with it. We're embracing things like reusable containers and local businesses again. The high street is fucked at the moment because it's big fuck off chains, but the smaller more 'personal' businesses are growing, look at gin bars and craft ale as examples.
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Old 28-03-2018, 20:27   #20
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Man is the only creature with the intelligence to know both that he SHOULD control his numbers, and with the ability to do it (contraception and abstinence). That we choose not to is because we are stupid, short-sighted and selfish.
Not stupid I don't think, just easy led by mass marketing pushing us to consume consume consume... i.e. capitalism.
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